He's been spawn camping me in argo and spam killing me for the past 30 minutes.

DWingKnight12 (ffo): You do realize at this point you're spam killing if you touch me again.
DWingKnight12 (ffo): That's 3 unprovoked attacks in a row now.
DWingKnight12 (ffo): Resulting in my death.
Shatter (ffo): your outlawed dosent count.
DWingKnight12 (ffo): So go cool ya head off for an hour.
Gae Bulg (ffo): You fighting back AT ALL = not spam kill.
DWingKnight12 (ffo): Im outlawed because he was casting an xmagic at me.
Gae Bulg (ffo): Any hostile actions commited negate the spam kill rule.
DWingKnight12 (ffo): And he killed me twice before that.
Gae Bulg (ffo): Which means.
DWingKnight12 (ffo): Without me touching him.
Gae Bulg (ffo): Protecting yourself aka your use of sleep/dark, negate spam kill.
DWingKnight12 (ffo): Yeah, that makes perfect sense!
DWingKnight12 (ffo): This is why I say rules should be abolished completely.

My IM to dean.

DPhoenixknight12 4:19 am
alright
so
tyr killed me 6 times
3 of those I didnt touch him
2 of those I fought back
last time I stood perfectly still, didnt do a thing to him
he got me low on health
and then pulled a monster to kill me
this is all me being spawn camped in argo
as he does drive bys

and some shots of chat log.

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r98/therealljmason/spamming1.png

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r98/therealljmason/spamming2.png

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r98/therealljmason/spamming3.png

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r98/therealljmason/spamming4.png

I have several witnesses who can vouch that this has been going on for days. Tyrael has been doing everything he can to harass me while towing the line of the spam kill rule. He claims to be harassing me because 'I constantly talk ****' which is odd considering I don't speak to him at all unless he starts mouthing at me over TRC.

When we wrote these rules we did not write them to be lawyered around and disregarded and disrespected such as players like Tyrael are doing. They should either be enforced stringently with a healthy dose of moderator discretion or abolished entirely.


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even though tyr is my ally and all, the fact that this **** is possible just cause he can lure a seagull or something into argo to finish off people is pretty abusable

now im no saint, i've done it repeatedly on po to newbies
if one finds something i want, and it pisses me off, ill sleep it, cure it, p1 it, and lure a wolf
gg newbie

it can also be applied to take detours around the spam killing rule outside of the island

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this made me actually laugh. you and iwamori were constantly attacking me and i was attacking you and because i killed you more you try and report spam killing.

you should know if your party members attack me its a hostile action for you too. its notmy fault iwa attacked me and you got stuck in the middle.

i killed you 7 times actually. 2 you attackedme right off the bat, 3 you didnt attack me at all hoever iwa did, and the other 2 i cannot confirm who attacked who first.

if you didnt want to be in the pvp you simply could have states "i dont want to pvp and have no intention of doing so" you did not state this and you did not leave the pvp area (argo) at all so you cant blame me for spam killing i followed all the rules to the letter.

furthermore as for the "ivekilled you constantly over the past few days" line the truth is yes i have and its because you instigate it in trc everyone has seen you mock me, troll me, and just outright disrespectme on trc and then you expect the player to leave you be? think about it

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I was there. Tyr even attacked me after I killed him for attacking this lp (lp was in my party). we fought a bit. He's been killing lp for a lil bit now. I don't know why. I personally don't care if Tyr gets banned. I informed him several times that he was attacking allies of the same alliance but he didnt care either.

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reply to Tyrael1337:

Every time I attacked you you were launching xmagic on me, don't even play innocent. Iwa kept hunting you down and attacking you because you were killing me every time I spawned. Saying you can't confirm who attacked who first is a weak copout. Bottom line though is that players like you have 0 respect for the rules and your attitude is best reflected in statements like "I followed the rules to the letter". The fact that you're carefully gliding along the nuances of the spamming rule to do as you please but jumping through just the right loopholes to not violate the rule black and white indisputably as displayed in the text of it destroys the point of the spamming rule in the first place. Spirit of the law vs. letter of the law. The letter of the law can be exploited but you and all the other players who act the way you do have enough common sense to know what you are doing and know the rules were designed with the intent of preventing it. Anything else to say for yourself here or are you going to continue being completely disrespectful of the game environment?

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reply to DWingKnight12:

Bottom line

1. you were actively attacking me with sleep to get guards tokill me
2. you did not leave the pvp area as the pvp rules state you should if you do not wish to pvp.
3. you were in a party with a enemy combatant which the rules say if you didnt wana pvp you shouldnt have been in a party with a pvpr.
4. you were tempering iwamori which again made you an enemy combatant.
5. you at no time said you didnt wana pvp you kept willingly running back into where the pvp was taking place.

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reply to Tyrael1337:

You were running through town on your knight after attacking and killing me several times on your red wizard charging me in attempts to keep killing me as I was spawning. I was sleeping you to try and prevent that happening. This was no PvP war this was you spawn camping and me attempting to defend myself once or twice, which even after I stopped you continued to run through town attacking me.

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Tyrael1337 wrote:

reply to DWingKnight12:

Bottom line

1. you were actively attacking me with sleep to get guards tokill me
2. you did not leave the pvp area as the pvp rules state you should if you do not wish to pvp.
3. you were in a party with a enemy combatant which the rules say if you didnt wana pvp you shouldnt have been in a party with a pvpr.
4. you were tempering iwamori which again made you an enemy combatant.
5. you at no time said you didnt wana pvp you kept willingly running back into where the pvp was taking place.

Let me clear a few things up for the both of you.

Yes, Iwamori did cast sleep on you which is considered a hostile action and would therefore give you a free ticket to attack him back.

The fact that you are outlawed SHOULD have negated this but we haven't updated the rules just yet.

Iwa could have simply let you kill him again without casting sleep on you and you would have been punished as it wouldn't have been HIM that refused to leave the PVP area it would have been YOU who were OUTLAWED intentionally making your way around the guards in order to PK him again. You also need to give him a verbal warning to leave and give him adequate time to leave AS STATED IN THE RULES.

I think we're going to need to clarify that you may not declare a town as an area of pvp, therefore you can't expect players to leave the town in order to not be PK'D.

The rules will be updated after the other admins and I go over them some more.



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uh, master's dont have sleep dean. the bm in question is LP

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A few things.

Gae Bulg (ffo): You fighting back AT ALL = not spam kill.

Fighting back is self-defense. If someone attacks you, you can defend yourself and it can still be considered spam-killing. We don't expect people to go, "Oh, some *** is attacking me, better limply fall over just so he'll get banned."

If he attacked -first- then it was a hostile action.

Tyrael wrote:

i killed you 7 times actually. 2 you attackedme right off the bat, 3 you didnt attack me at all hoever iwa did, and the other 2 i cannot confirm who attacked who first.

You might want to re-read the rules you are toeing, son.

2) A player is considered to have taken a hostile action if they:
a) Attack you, a party member, a domain improvement (of your domain of residency), military unit (of your domain of residency), or a fellow citizen of your domain of residency (while that citizen is within the domain).
.....

If Iwa attacked you, then your entire party could retaliate against Iwamori and it would not count as self-defense.

This does not mean if Iwa attacks you, then you can retaliate against Iwa's entire party. Only Iwa is making the hostile action.

I think there is adequate proof to issue out a punishment.

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I only attacked Tyr at first because he was attacking LP, who was in my party, and is really low level black mage. Only once I engaged Tyrael did he engage me. I think it's within the rules if he's attacking my party member and i rush to defend.

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Yeah, Shane is correct. I misread. If you Tyr attacked before he slept and it was self-defense then this does not count as a hostile action on Iwa's behalf.

I misread this as 'Tyr was outlawed and Iwa slept him'.

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This does not mean if Iwa attacks you, then you can retaliate against Iwa's entire party. Only Iwa is making the hostile action.

Why not? If someone in a party attacks me, shouldn't I have the right to assume the rest of his party might be hostile as well? They could just leave the party if they didn't want to be involved in the fight their party member started.

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Locke wrote:

This does not mean if Iwa attacks you, then you can retaliate against Iwa's entire party. Only Iwa is making the hostile action.

Why not? If someone in a party attacks me, shouldn't I have the right to assume the rest of his party might be hostile as well? They could just leave the party if they didn't want to be involved in the fight their party member started.

'The fight Iwa started' Was him running Tyrael off because he had already killed me and was coming after me again. He had killed me about 35 to 45 minutes beforehand too. Iwa didnt use sleep, I used sleep first on his red wizard as he came into the argo docks and began to cast xmagic on me. I slept him, it stuck, I jetted to new banian docks. You know, trying to get out of the situation. Nowhere to run as a fat slow bm so I tried fighting him off, that's where you see him killing me with fire.

After this takes place and he dies to iwa a second time he switches onto his knight and begins charge attacking me in argo, gets another kill in on me this way. He gets slept several times to prevent him charge attacking me as he repeatedly runs through argo. Gets one good charge off and kills me again.

Next he knows he really cant touch me again without being in violation of the spam rule. so he hits me once, poison tics chew my health up, I am standing there minding my own. I have not used any kind of support spells or done anything to help iwa this entire time. He runs into town with a mob spawn and drags a seagull successfully to me to kill me again.

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Locke wrote:

This does not mean if Iwa attacks you, then you can retaliate against Iwa's entire party. Only Iwa is making the hostile action.

Why not? If someone in a party attacks me, shouldn't I have the right to assume the rest of his party might be hostile as well? They could just leave the party if they didn't want to be involved in the fight their party member started.

I have never seen a fight break out with that sort of logic being applied in real life.

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This isn't real life, though. This is a video game where the reasons for partying up include fighting NPCs, mobs, or players. Since pvp is one reason to form a party, and if one player begins an engagement and is part of a party, it stands to reason to suspect the rest of the party. Otherwise, you're just setting yourself up to get ambushed.

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Locke wrote:

This isn't real life, though. This is a video game where the reasons for partying up include fighting NPCs, mobs, or players. Since pvp is one reason to form a party, and if one player begins an engagement and is part of a party, it stands to reason to suspect the rest of the party. Otherwise, you're just setting yourself up to get ambushed.

Locke I described the circumstances of this 'engagement' and they are so completely far away from the logic you're trying to employ here. Iwa and I have been partying and grinding experience and being old bros before hos and etc for days now. During this time Tyr has been repeatedly harassing me in a similar fashion to what happened last night and towing the line of the spam killing rule as much as possible. Iwa got sick of it and was swatting him away last night as I was keeping my distance and minding my own, which Tyr knew full well and disregarded to choose to keep attacking me.

I'm looking at other topics and seeing where people were banned for showing pure disregard for the rules by the way they flirted with them. I'd love to either see this punishment become a strict and regular practice or the rules to be abolished entirely because no matter how well worded they are players that have no respect for the game or the rules, such as Tyrael, will continue to do everything they can to dance on the line and be incorrigible.

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reply to Locke:

I agree i saw Lp tempering iwa, grabbing dc's,prasying etc and yet he says his deaths were unfair. furthermore at one point i stopped attacking him and start going after lp (this was the time i started running through town and it was at this time he began sleep spamming me to try and get guards to gank me it was only after this stunt i started attacking him again)

at oner point he even randomly casted dark onme as i ran through town and yet he saysme killing him was unfair? i call bull**** this is a simple matter of him getting his ass handed to him themn not being happy with the results.

Furthermore there was more than enough reason to consider him a hostile target

1. he was parying for people i had killed
2. he was grabbing dc'd of people i had killed
3. he slept my rw when i DISENCUMBERED (wasant even an xmagic turn your dang sounds on)
4. he started sleep spamming my knight as i was runnng though town BEFORE i hit him
5. he was attacking me back
6. he was lending aid to iwa by tempering him

this fight was rediculous and its laughable it ended in a ban but thats fine ill take the 1 day ban.

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DWingKnight12 wrote:

Locke wrote:

This isn't real life, though. This is a video game where the reasons for partying up include fighting NPCs, mobs, or players. Since pvp is one reason to form a party, and if one player begins an engagement and is part of a party, it stands to reason to suspect the rest of the party. Otherwise, you're just setting yourself up to get ambushed.

Locke I described the circumstances of this 'engagement' and they are so completely far away from the logic you're trying to employ here. Iwa and I have been partying and grinding experience and being old bros before hos and etc for days now. During this time Tyr has been repeatedly harassing me in a similar fashion to what happened last night and towing the line of the spam killing rule as much as possible. Iwa got sick of it and was swatting him away last night as I was keeping my distance and minding my own, which Tyr knew full well and disregarded to choose to keep attacking me.

I'm looking at other topics and seeing where people were banned for showing pure disregard for the rules by the way they flirted with them. I'd love to either see this punishment become a strict and regular practice or the rules to be abolished entirely because no matter how well worded they are players that have no respect for the game or the rules, such as Tyrael, will continue to do everything they can to dance on the line and be incorrigible.

iwa onlycame down and joined your party when you both started fighting me cut the bs with a butter knife please.

i wasnt towing any lines of any rules i killed you twice and then you suckedup to iwa and brought him down and then you sleptmy rw and it wentfrom spam killing to generic pvp after that and you know it but as i said before ill accept the 1 day ban.

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Tyrael1337 wrote:

iwa onlycame down and joined your party when you both started fighting me cut the bs with a butter knife please.

i wasnt towing any lines of any rules i killed you twice and then you suckedup to iwa and brought him down and then you sleptmy rw and it wentfrom spam killing to generic pvp after that and you know it but as i said before ill accept the 1 day ban.

Iwa had been in my party the entire time as we had been desert training. I never randomly casted dark on you and I never tempered him, if you look in the screenshots you can probably see some of the him screaming for tempers and me refusing them.

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